Guide to the primary 8-string tunings

[Ethan Shaw]

If any of my steel guitar friends are cooped-up and bored today, this might be interesting to you. I tried to be objective about it , but steel guitarists get really worked up about anything tuning related, so apologies in advance if I offended anyone, haha! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSjW9Fe3uk

[Will Houston]

Good one Ethan, yes tuning info can be tricky business, well done

[Nic Neufeld]

Good intro to these tunings (and nice backbreaker of a quad!)!

I've dabbled with E13 (a couple versions) but always find it feels foreign to actually play unless you are just hitting funky chords. The problem is me ultimately, just not familiar enough with it.

C13 is so very-nearly C6 that it almost isn't its own tuning, but that's a useful variation of C6, setting the 7th string to Bb. It's basically still C6, you just have to know when to mute/skip that string if you don't want the dominant 7 in there.

On that statement by Billy Hew Len, I bet you are right that JB's use of C6 made the next generation of Hawaiian steelers move more in that direction than A6, but JB didn't get there til 1970 or so, and in the 50s and 60s, some of the biggest steel guitarists there were probably primarily C6 players...the Hawaii Calls guys like Jules Ah See and Barney Isaacs mostly recorded / performed in C6/C13 (with B11 and other tunings sprinkled in). But if you look at players in the islands nowadays...many of them were taught by Jerry or taught by somebody taught by Jerry (eg Alan Akaka) so it makes sense that C6 ended up the dominant strain. BHL was an A6er though (I still would love to know exactly how he had his Fender 400 set up).

If anyone wants another deep dive, I enjoyed this demo by Alan, probably posted here before. He walks through a bunch of tunings without changing his guitar... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G8qAmotF_c

[Jim Newberry]

If anyone wants another deep dive, I enjoyed this demo by Alan, probably posted here before. He walks through a bunch of tunings without changing his guitar... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G8qAmotF_c

I was there for that! It was a great presentation.

[Ethan Shaw]

I appreciate y'all watching and glad you enjoyed it! Nic, I've thought about that timeline also, and that's a good point about JB. I heard the recording where BHL said that, and thought it was pretty interesting. But yeah, Jules Ah See and Barney Isaacs were killing it on C6. I wonder if they got it from listening to JB. (Listening to the Tapa room tapes, it sounds like Jules was also a Joaquin fan.) I'm definitely more in the world of Western Swing than Hawaiian music (although I love it!), so I'll defer to all of y'all who know that world better. I'd love to know your theories of how the Hawaiians started playing C6. There are so many approaches to making the music we love, and that's one of the things I love about the steel guitar! My original video had several more tunings and delved into the theory behind all of them, but it was almost 45 minutes long, haha! I decided to try to whittle it down to the most common ones. That Alan Akaka video is great and pretty thorough!

[Tim Toberer]

Great overview Ethan. For plain steel I am an A6 advocate as well. I am gonna try out that B11/F#m6 tuning (even though there is no B!) A6 and C6 are great for almost anything, as you said and also agree if you are playing jazz, at some point you probably will want to add a dominant tuning.

[Twayn Williams]

Thanks for the vid! I watched it a few days ago while doomscrolling on youtube.

I'm a 6-string E13 player for swing. But I recently picked up a 2nd Rick Panda and put it into B11 so I could play Sand. But for improvising, I'm having a hard time trying to adjust to a stack of 3rds and no major 2nds. I wouldn't mind being able to get around in a 4-string A6 (i.e. the top 4 strings of B11) but it's been like swimming through concrete ::sigh::

[Ethan Shaw]

Thanks y'all! Yeah, there are pros and cons to every tuning. B11 would be not ideal for a primary tuning, but I do think it is worth trying out and seeing what you can do with it.

[Nic Neufeld]

But I recently picked up a 2nd Rick Panda and put it into B11 so I could play Sand. But for improvising, I'm having a hard time trying to adjust to a stack of 3rds and no major 2nds. I wouldn't mind being able to get around in a 4-string A6 (i.e. the top 4 strings of B11) but it's been like swimming through concrete ::sigh::

I know there are people who can jam in B11...but unfortunately -most- of them died decades ago . For me, I don't spend enough time in it as a primary tuning to be able to improvise well in it...I just use it for certain songs that I learned in the tuning (eg Sand as you mentioned). It's a pretty easy retune from A6 (or C6) so there's always the option of just doing a quick retune before and after Sand...that's just the two low strings on a 6-string in A6.

Other than that, I think the key to getting proficient in B11 is just continuing to force yourself to swim through that concrete...keep playing B11 on songs you don't know an arrangement of in B11, forcing yourself to get kind of used to it. It probably also helps to listen to how players used it when improvising backing...Danny Stewart on this track is a good example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaNl_NEk0rI You hear him kind of jump between the B9th and A6th sides...

[BJ Burbach]

Ethan, love your videos. Thanks much. I am mostly C13 and I play solo, so love that low C. No bass player problem.
BJ

[Twayn Williams]

But I recently picked up a 2nd Rick Panda and put it into B11 so I could play Sand. But for improvising, I'm having a hard time trying to adjust to a stack of 3rds and no major 2nds. I wouldn't mind being able to get around in a 4-string A6 (i.e. the top 4 strings of B11) but it's been like swimming through concrete ::sigh::

I know there are people who can jam in B11...but unfortunately -most- of them died decades ago . For me, I don't spend enough time in it as a primary tuning to be able to improvise well in it...I just use it for certain songs that I learned in the tuning (eg Sand as you mentioned). It's a pretty easy retune from A6 (or C6) so there's always the option of just doing a quick retune before and after Sand...that's just the two low strings on a 6-string in A6.

Other than that, I think the key to getting proficient in B11 is just continuing to force yourself to swim through that concrete...keep playing B11 on songs you don't know an arrangement of in B11, forcing yourself to get kind of used to it. It probably also helps to listen to how players used it when improvising backing...Danny Stewart on this track is a good example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaNl_NEk0rI You hear him kind of jump between the B9th and A6th sides...

I originally thought that I could just retune from B11 to B6 (which I know) or A6 (which I don't know), but it puts the rest of the strings out of tune, and I don't find that amount of retuning to be viable on the gig And now I know why those multi-neck monsterosities were developed So I'm stuck with trying to learn to improvise in B11 and not lose my E13 skills. Ah well...

[Ethan Shaw]

BJ, I love that low C, too, when I play that C6 tuning! Twayn, I definitely think it would work better to just do the one string half-step change from A6 to B11 like I talked about in the video. If you are usually using B6, I would just drop down that F# to E, and then you would get the equivalent C#11 tuning.

[Ethan Shaw]

Good example, NIc!